Main Rape and Main Taking

[Pinky]

This topic comes up often.

Let's have an open discussion, where each might state their opinion of any proposed solution. This is a gaming group and we play this game we all love and enjoy, most of the time...

It seems like I used to play on a server where you couldn't take main. You could get by the flag but nothing would change. That is a possible "programming" solution.

We could have a rule that there is no main raping by anything that flies at any time. This would allow players to drive tanks into main, boats to main, etc. (This wouldn't solve the need for admin intervention to punish those who violate the rules).

I have heard the arguments, well if a team can't keep more than one flag, they deserve it. I don't agree. You put the best players of the game on the same team and the underdog is toast. It leads to players circling main in choppers killing players spawning over and over. This frustrates them. They go spectate; don't spawn or leave the server. Players with honor and respect hold back and hang out waiting for the team to get air going so they can fight in the air.

I don't know that any part of this game has caused more angst than main attacks.

I support a rule that players may not attack main by air at any time. Mains may be taken but only ground. This will stop players from circling main with choppers spawn killing.

Thank you for allowing me to express my opinion. I would like to hear your opinion and please do so without attacking mine. I'll read and fairly consider your point of view.

If you can do so, without personal attacks, it would be nice to have an open discussion on a topic of interest.

pinky

 

[htn]

They are free to post their opinion. Don't know why they don't post. Maybe they just want to play and don't talk about rules etc...

I know it sounds maybe strange, but the comparison of ticket-bleeding (which indeed was in my opinion high, but except that, I always thought it was buggy, because the bleeding never stopped, no matter how much flags the team had...quite buggy) and the change request of one of the core-rule is not really fair

And if the jungle maps take too long now there are 2 solutions:
- Increase the bleeding again (but watch out for the bug)
- Be a good fighter and knock the opposite team out

 

[Pinky]

Well i agree with solution to make this bleed faster - cuz jungle maps sometimes very very longplayed and boring - i help Ice with edit tickets bleed - i dont know what amount he set - but it was 12 tickets per min. default was 5 tickets. maybe he set 7-8 - so it will be not so important. As for other player i think -mustly of them don`t care about what we have on forum. As Barfly say to me once - "I want to play with many people - what else will be - i dont`t care" .
On mission possible server jungle maps tickets by default - and it really boring sometimes....

When I was working on maps changing for mission possible server, I tried many times to get people to the forum and leave comments with opinions about something new, but it was not successful.

Any ideas on how to attract ordinary players to the forum so that they could also participate?

Yes, I have an idea. You remove those who bully others. All should be able to speak their opinions. Freely.

As for the jungle maps, they were changed because they go so long. I love the jungle maps. When you have 25 or so players on.

A month or two ago, we were to the point of simply letting one team take all the flags so we could get on to the next map. And this was on the fast bleed setting.

 

[Pinky]

do you really think that if we remove someone it will help other players to post a comment here? I think you are kidding.

No, my suggestion is that all should have a say and that if there is any retaliation against those who post an opinion on any topic, and by retaliation I mean attacks on the player here or by in-game chat, the bully should be punished.

 

[Pinky]

Pisky, you look like Santa Claus!

 

[mRoRange]

Who is bullying and preventing others from posting? I posted a comical response earlier, it was meant to show or possibly expose the details that i think are not missing or don't exist. It was a joke, I m not being silenced like anyone else is.

1. Who is preventing others from posting?
2. This forum is ongoing, open, voluntary, and free of speech seems to apply here.
3. What , why and who is the hold up here and why is this a perpetual question?

It just seems like this is going in circles every 90 or plus days. I guess there is much more to this and way over my head.

Let me ask who are all these people that want change and are up in arms and may not be able to voice their opinion if the rules aren't changed, just not seeing it.

 

[HueyBob]

There was a 1.0 Server (FunGaming/FG^Clan) that had a SSM solution: it created dead-zones around the main flags that would damage the opposition.
I know 1.0 was closer to BF1942 than 1.21 but maybe something similar could be modded?
The FG^Clan became KGC Clan (were active on 1.2) and their leader was Barfly, maybe he could help? -I don't know if they used similar SSM's on their 1.2 servers.
Another solution I've seen was to add more antiair assets around Mains, for example: I think FG server had Lookout Towers with ZSU turrets modded on top.
Baserape by air is a longstanding issue in all BF games, the simplest fix I saw was for one of BF2's mods (possibly NAWmod or AIX mod -can't remember) that had reduced aircraft ammo and required all aircraft to return to main base to slowly reload (not just a quick flyby) so the enemy could attack main but didn't have unlimited loiter-time over target (Saying that: BF2 generally had more AA assets dotted around the maps anyway, which helped).

 

[BarFly]

There was a 1.0 Server (FunGaming/FG^Clan) that had a SSM solution: it created dead-zones around the main flags that would damage the opposition.
I know 1.0 was closer to BF1942 than 1.21 but maybe something similar could be modded?
The FG^Clan became KGC Clan (were active on 1.2) and their leader was Barfly, maybe he could help? -I don't know if they used similar SSM's on their 1.2 servers.
Another solution I've seen was to add more antiair assets around Mains, for example: I think FG server had Lookout Towers with ZSU turrets modded on top.
Baserape by air is a longstanding issue in all BF games, the simplest fix I saw was for one of BF2's mods (possibly NAWmod or AIX mod -can't remember) that had reduced aircraft ammo and required all aircraft to return to main base to slowly reload (not just a quick flyby) so the enemy could attack main but didn't have unlimited loiter-time over target (Saying that: BF2 generally had more AA assets dotted around the maps anyway, which helped).

You are right about we had the mains shielded to effectively avoid mainrape. Some liked the shields, some... did not
This is very easy to set up, and I know Pisky won't need my poor help to do that The fact we went KGC from FG is not true.
KGC was from the start in 2004 =TopGun=Elite school. A modded 24/7 Flaming Dart map only where we took the Phantoms and Cobras away. This to make the game more even and you must be a good pilot to kill someone. (No heatseekers) It was more like NVA vs NVA.
After the =Topgun= name, we cut it a bit and the new name was =TPG=
My first BFV-nick was =TopGun= HawkEye, named after some letters in my first name and my Callaway golf clubs, lol. Suddenly a (kid?) named hawkeye... Just hawkeye... cried and told me I had stolen his nick. I decided to change, why argue BarFly was born and after the 2:nd change of name, so was =KGC=

/BarFly

 

[mRoRange]

We may never know a lot of things but it's not because anyone or anything is suppressing comments or thoughts from anyone here.
I think it's very childish to keep pushing conspiracy theories that people are being bullied and threatened as of now if they say something on the forum when you have zero proof.

Let's move on from this and quit saying we don't know when we do. Hinting, implying, or starting rumors that this happening is nonsense. These threads-like others have a ton of feedback and a chunk of the community has not lost it identity and running around scared just because Pinky says it's so. I find it comical that you have quit this community so many times over the years because it wasn't what you wanted, rules didn't align with you, or map rotations. And in the end, you were given chance after chance to come back after you quit abruptly in disgust each time. Now, you are worried people haven't said what they need to say and not based on feedback from these people, or Ice, a database dump, or a poll, just your assumption.

The members that chime in here are relevant, current, and present. Members that chose not to comment have a choice as in any open forum.

 

[BarFly]

Yeah - i am one them who like and hate that shield at the same time)
yes it is not hard to do that
But better we have second hello server where we have doubleflag rule - msission possible server - it is more fair ingame.
Also there mati ( m@gic =d][b= ) servers where i made some airmaps rework(OFD also there - no heatseekers at air server) and allmaps server where all maps from KGC (the last one KGC server from time where i was admin there- BAR how can you kill server(((( )
[/QUOTE]

I didn't kill it Pisk. I just got tired of the host forgetting to open game ports, remote port or other important things to get it to work after their upgrades.
I felt like a paine in the ass calling them all the time. In a game with often none or very few players, I let it go..
You made a great job with all maps and I'm glad you let other servers to run them now
About the main rape..
It's a good feeling sometimes to defend the last flag against raping choppers. Switch to LAW and shoot a heli down feels "like a half" f...

/BarFly

 

[IceSkater]

I didn't kill it Pisk. I just got tired of the host forgetting to open game ports, remote port or other important things to get it to work after their upgrades.
I felt like a paine in the ass calling them all the time. In a game with often none or very few players, I let it go..
You made a great job with all maps and I'm glad you let other servers to run them now
About the main rape..
It's a good feeling sometimes to defend the last flag against raping choppers. Switch to LAW and shoot a heli down feels "like a half" f...

/BarFly

I'm sorry to butt in on this and talk off topic, but that's really crappy support from them. They're supposed to double check their side, that's wholly unacceptable from a company (I assume gameservers.com?).

Self hosted or dedicated servers (where you have full control) is the only way to go. As with the saying - you want something done right, you have to do it yourself - in these cases.

 

[HueyBob]

@BarFly
Sorry bud, my memory was bad before I got older lol, I remember now, I think it was a guy called Spoiler who ran FG^
Not sure why I thought FG^ turned into KGC, unless you absorbed some of their members when they stopped the clan?

 

[HueyBob]

Just to drag thread back on topic: Would there be a way to move the mains flags to an out-of-bounds area? yet keep the spawnpoints at base?.
Or, some maps have parachute spawns, is there a way to add them to other maps? -An extra chute spawn over each main would make it easier to defend/retake (even when flag is lost).
Or what if the main flag cap radius was smaller, causing the enemy to stand close to the flagpole? (would make it harder to retake though)
Just spittin ideas

 

[Pinky]

We may never know a lot of things but it's not because anyone or anything is suppressing comments or thoughts from anyone here.
I think it's very childish to keep pushing conspiracy theories that people are being bullied and threatened as of now if they say something on the forum when you have zero proof.

Let's move on from this and quit saying we don't know when we do. Hinting, implying, or starting rumors that this happening is nonsense. These threads-like others have a ton of feedback and a chunk of the community has not lost it identity and running around scared just because Pinky says it's so. I find it comical that you have quit this community so many times over the years because it wasn't what you wanted, rules didn't align with you, or map rotations. And in the end, you were given chance after chance to come back after you quit abruptly in disgust each time. Now, you are worried people haven't said what they need to say and not based on feedback from these people, or Ice, a database dump, or a poll, just your assumption.

The members that chime in here are relevant, current, and present. Members that chose not to comment have a choice as in any open forum.

Take a chill pill Orange. You have posted twice, basically attacking me, when I didn't post a response between yours. Odd. Interesting. This topic is about main taking and should a rule be considered about that. For some reason, you are interested in making this about me.

I don't give a rat's ass if there is rule or not, I'm just trying to keep players playing the game. Players leave the server when rape takes place. Perhaps asking players to vote on the topic.

pinky

 

[mRoRange]

I'm not upset or attacking you, but I do think it's very odd and that it seems based on your ongoing obsession with some shadow conspiracy that is floating over members' heads preventing them from making a simple comment. While on the other hand you have for years posted ongoing thousands of tweaks and complaints of what you want while leaving and coming back and leaving, with demands if changes arent made you will leave for good. Now saying there are bullies out there preventing people from commenting. And at the same time, in your recent comeback to the server, you hid your identity with a false name. It all seems odd to me coming from you. If you didn't have the history and I didn't know all this I would not be commenting on this at all. You don't consider someone knowing your history and antics, hiding under false names, and now saying bullies are running out players from the forum seems a little stretch. I won't make another comment about the bullies doing their business again. Just found it odd you keep throwing it out there.